User talk:Supermorff

A query I have
Hello Supermorff,

I've been informed from Kagimizu that I should seek a mod about a query I have instead of actually trying to edit the articles themselves so I simply chose you out of random because I can't seem to find anyone in charge of this wiki as a whole admin.

Anyways, this topic is about the trivia sections on this site. I've been here at SNN for some time (I believe since June) and think this Sonic wiki is a good idea. A place where every fan can input info they find. I come to this site often to get info and listings. It's all good except for one section: trivia. When I look at the trivia sections, it's a complete mess. There is information in those sections on almost every page with trivia that should not belong. Some of them are fan speculations, others are hypothesis and guesses, and some are just dumb and pointless. At this time, I thought someone was not taking care of this and all this info was inputted by someone who had no idea what they were doing or what belong in the article or not. So I decided to edit them myself and clean up the trivia sections that had information not necessary. Well to my surprise, they kept reappearing. Every page I went, the info kept popping up. At first I thought it was some stubborn user but then it turned out it was none other than Kagimizu, a mod. It would be understandable if it was some user who did not know how to input info into a trivia section but if a mod approves of such info, then we got a problem here.

I'm a fan of the trivia sections. I love them because you get even more in depth info from the subject in question that you would not learn formally. But when I come to SNN, I am displeased to learn that almost anything is put into the trivia sections. It's as if no one knows how to do a trivia section properly and assume anything can be put in.

A trivia section is a section of an article where info that cannot be placed on the main article is placed on it's own section. This info is not important enough to be a part of the main section but still useful enough to be known so it should not be omitted. The information that goes into a trivia section adds and expands the article and gives more insight, knowledge, and description to the subject. Wikipedia's guidelines for trivia state that it's info that can not fit anywhere and the editor should try to look for a place to put it in. In other words, trivia is the last thing that should be worked on because you want to search for a place to fit the info on the article and add to it. If it can't be added, then it's considered trivial and thus, goes into it's own section.

But this does not apply to SNN. When I see an trivia section, I am seeing information that is quiet useless to know about such as comparing one character to another. I don't understand why I need to know about a trait that is more coincidental than it is about the development of the character. If one character has a trait that is similar to another, such as Blaze being similar to Knuckles in the fact that they are guardians of certain emeralds, then you must ask yourself "Why is this important to the article?" In the example I showed, how does that information help the Blaze article expand more and give insight to her. If it was stated by a employee at Sega that they got inspiration from Knuckles when modeling Blaze, than that would be considered trivia since you would not be able to fit it into the article itself but is important to the understanding of Blaze's development. But if it's just a coincidence that Blaze so happens to be like Knuckles in only that they share that trait and there is nothing to back up that they both share such a common feature besides it being a coincidence, than that is not trivia because it does not help the expand the article and it's pretty much just an observation someone made.

There are many common mistakes that are added to the trivia sections. Others being fan speculations, good obsevations that are not informative enough to warrant research, what people "think" might be, and stuff that is not informative at all and are just comments. These may be interesting to know but when I read them, they didn't add to the article I was reading and didn't help my research. It felt like I was reading a persons comment rather than an excerpt of the subject. If the item doesn't give you applied knowledge, it should not be included.

I believe that the trivia sections need a serious clean up. If a mod approves it, then that means that no one here knows how trivia should be done. Serious guidelines should be done for trivia and what it is, what should go in it, and so on. The other info is not important to be warranted as research. Though I have thought about why a mod would approve of it, I come to the conclusion that they consider it important to know. I came to this because I remember I edited out a bad trivia item when I was editing articles. When it was brought back though, that item was not. So there is some attention being put to the trivia sections but no real guideline. That is why I propose there be a new section: miscellaneous. Just what it means, anything and everything else that doesn't even fit in trivia. While trivia SHOULD still cover the article's items that are not important to be in the article itself but still important enough to be known, miscellaneous is just information that is not really important to know but have been observed and might be of interest one way or another. Observations that have bee noted like comparing one character to another (especially when the other character is not even from Sega) is not really trivia but can be put into miscellaneous. I think it would clean up the trivia section and make it more neat.

So that is my post. Sorry if it's huge but it should show you that I am serious about the trivia sections. I love them and hate to see this wiki mishandle them just because people don't understand what trivia means. Just because trivia means info that cannot be inserted into the main article, it does not mean ANYTHING can be placed under it. It should still contain information that adds to the article in a small way but gives you a bit more information about the subject that is necessary to know about. Anything that is simply observed or coincidences are not trivia unless it is backed up by a source of information that is not hearsay or guessing. If you want to have that information, then a good idea would be to make a separate section for them. This will help keep the article in order so when you get to the trivia section, it won't be a jumble mess and you will be able to tell what's actual fact and what is a possibility. --TKGB 07:27, October 7, 2009 (UTC)
 * Well I'm glad that you agree and was surprised to know that someone else has a concern about it. But that still doesn't solve anything. Isn't there anything that can be done about this? Simply editing it won't do since someone will just end up undoing it.--TKGB 00:28, October 8, 2009 (UTC)

Actually, that's not entirely true. If we simply keep an eye on the articles and remove uneeded info, that should really clean up the Trivia.--Kagi mizu -Seeya  'round ~ 00:36, October 8, 2009 (UTC)
 * Well that would be ideal except that people don't understand what trivia is here. There is no guideline for that in this wiki and people just keep posting items unrelated to being trivia and it keeps being approved. So when you say "uneeded", what does that mean here? That's why I'm proposing two sections. That would be ideal to keep stuff that is still revelant to the subject and info that is are just hypothesis that people have (i.e. "...because of this, it is believed that...").--TKGB 00:47, October 8, 2009 (UTC)

Well, Trivia already has its own "section" on pages, but seperate pages is too far. The way I see it, if the trivia is notable and relevant, it's fine by me. For example, some new trivia that was added to Amy's page was that "Amy is currently the only female hedgehog in the games". Stuff like that seems reasonable to me.--Kagi mizu -Seeya  'round ~ 00:52, October 8, 2009 (UTC)
 * See, that kind of information is not trivia. Firstly, what I suggested was not a new page but a new category for this kind of thing. Second, I don't think you understand the meaning of trivia. As I've said on the original long post I made for Supermorff, trivia is information that aids the article. It helps expand the article on knowledge about the subject. Don't you think that pointing out that Amy is the only female hedgehog is too loose to be considered helpful. If you approve of that, how about "Amy is currently the only pink female character". How about "Amy is currently the only character who wields a hammer". Or "Amy is currently the only character that was kidnapped by Metal Sonic" and "Amy is currently the only hedgehog whose design has changed drastically"? You have to ask yourself if the information is helpful in research and development of the character both ingame and real world, not just observations.

If you still can't understand what I mean, consider another subject. Let me use English as an example. Look at this site:

http://www.sentex.net/~ajy/facts/words.html

The site contains many information that can be considered trivia. So by your approval, one could put "As of today, the letter Y is the only one that can be used as both a vowel and a consonant." Yeah, thats nice but it's pretty obvious that most people know about it so it doesn't need to be written down. I hope you understand what I mean. --TKGB 06:13, October 8, 2009 (UTC)

In my books, if you have several strings of trivia related to each other, then those need to be clumped together to form a new section, as was the case with Silver when I first came here. Trivia is my biggest crib with this wikia and I'm a reglaur visitor here. I raised this issue recently, because Silver's trivia section was massive. I listed elsewhere several points and problems with trivia. In the end it comes down to this: Can it fit elsewhere on the page? If yes, then it doesn't belong in trivia. If not, then it belongs in trivia.

As a experience wikia peep, this wikia can be off putting at times, but I come here because I have long term issues with wikipedia (used to be a wikipedian until 2 years ago or so). At the very least, what someone needs to do is look at the largest section on the page other then trivia (not including galleries) and ask "Is the trivia section bigger then this?". If yes, something needs to be done ASAP, as I had to do with Silver's page. Regardless, I'm happy to see it finally being discussed, but there seems to be a problem with controlling it. If you have guidelines for trivia, that would help, if not, perhaps its time something was done. One-Winged Hawk 15:16, October 8, 2009 (UTC)

Re: User masthead
Hey Supermorff. Sorry for the late reply. I just tested this code and it worked, so just add it to Monaco.css and hard refresh (Ctrl+F5).

color: #000000 !important; }
 * 1) page_tabs a {

color: #BA0000 !important; }
 * 1) page_tabs a.new {

background-color: #FFFFFF !important; }
 * 1) page_tabs li.selected a, #page_tabs li.selected a.new {

background-color: #EEEEEE !important; }
 * 1) page_tabs li a, #page_tabs li a.new {

body.masthead-regular #page_bar, body.masthead-special #page_bar { border-bottom: none; }

While we're talking about css colors, I was wondering if you'd want to make the text on the header buttons (GAMING and MORE) more visible. They're quite hard to read. If you want to change that text color, edit this item in Monaco.css:

/* this makes the background of those 'pill' buttons blue also */ .headerMenuButton dt, .headerMenuButton dd { background-image: url(http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/help/images/3/3a/Sapphire_header_button.png); color: #808080; } Just change #808080 to white or a light gray (such as #DDDDDD, #CCCCCC, etc.) to match the color of the little down arrow. Let me know if you have any problems or need help with anything else. JoePlay ( talk ) 21:30, December 29, 2009 (UTC)


 * If you use Firefox, then Firebug is a very useful tool for troubleshooting css code used on the Monaco skin. JoePlay ( talk ) 19:57, December 30, 2009 (UTC)

Regarding Eggman's eyes…
Of course that video showed Eggman's eyes. Very clearly it did, even. The camera was, at multiple times, at an angle that cleary revealed his eyes. Here's a screenshot someone took also showing it. Herman2000 19:41, January 14, 2010 (UTC)

Well, I disagree there, indeed. If it's in the game, it's obviously canon. Herman2000 01:19, January 15, 2010 (UTC)

Sir Frances Charles. His full name was revealed in SatAM. Trust me, I wouldn't lie. Watch SatAm to comfirm my sources though I can't remember which episode. Sonic &amp; Scrab  Master

Voice Actors
Actually, I know that Kappei Yamaguchi didn't voice Sonic for a fact. 1. He voices Inuyasha from the anime InuYasha and I know that his voice wouldn't fit. 2. Out of all the sources I read about him, none of them say he voiced Sonic. 3. I also looked for the Japanese versions of SU and AOSTH, none of them have Yamaguchi-san. 4. I have many friends who know about him, and they all say he has never voiced Sonic. Sonic &amp; Scrab  Master   Kongosoha!  21:55, November 3, 2010 (UTC)


 * Agreed. Sonic &amp; Scrab  Master   Kongosoha!  22:08, November 3, 2010 (UTC)

Fourth Wall
Quick question. Do any characters in StC break the Fourth Wall? Sonic &amp; Scrab  Master   Kongosoha!  21:01, November 28, 2010 (UTC)


 * Just classic breaking the fourth wall. You know, looking at and talking to the viewer. Knowing they're in a comic. All that stuff. Sonic &amp; Scrab  Master   Kongosoha!  21:16, November 28, 2010 (UTC)


 * Then use that. Sonic &amp; Scrab  Master   Kongosoha!  21:32, November 28, 2010 (UTC)


 * You should do it. I know little to nothing about StC. Plus, I'm a little busy with other matters. Sonic &amp; Scrab  Master   Kongosoha!  21:45, November 28, 2010 (UTC)

Talk Page
I always believed that removing other peoples' messages was rude. And that one needs to ask permission before removing it. I've also seen that removing is sometimes a way to make someone seem innocent in a certain problem. Sonic &amp; Scrab  Master   Kongosoha!  19:22, December 9, 2010 (UTC)


 * I see. I'm sorry. Sonic &amp; Scrab  Master   Kongosoha!  19:30, December 9, 2010 (UTC)

Hey
How goes it, Supermorff? Sorry I didnt reply to your message right away. I saw it a few minutes after you left it but I really had to.... actually, you dont wanna know what I had to go do. I was also busy on a trip in another country. Guess where.

CANADA. Ontario, actually. Anyways can you help me delete some stuff? There's a bunch of unnecessary pictures that you can see in the speedy deletion page.

-- Eh, What's up Doc?   ~  DjWindmaster97  08:52, July 6, 2010 (UTC)


 * Canada actually wasnt so bad. They've got nice neighborhoods, the street signs are in English, I saw Niagara Falls, and I went to the CN Tower in Toronto. However, there were a lot of Asian people there for reasons that are far beyond me.... And I dont mean the Korean-looking Asian, but Asians in general (Arabs, Indians, Chinese, Japanese etc).


 * And you dont have to rush yourself deleting those pictures. Most of them are just a bunch of tiny, lo-res pics that DiscoDuck uploaded (not to mention he never categorizes them).

-- Eh, What's up Doc?   ~  DjWindmaster97  09:23, July 6, 2010 (UTC)

Merchandise Category
Hey, hey, hey. How's life, Supermorff? I just came back from a trip to Germany to visit some family members (not that I'm German), and since I was suffering from jet lag and everything was in Deutsch, I haven't been able to go online as much. But at least one of the few times that I went on the internet I was lucky enough to get the chance to vote for my favorite character (Knuckley Knuckles of course) in the Character Tournament.

Anyways, I wanted to ask you if I could make a category for images of all types of merchandise except for games. I once tried to make such a category, but was quickly shot down by another Admin who said that we already had a category for merchandise (the "Sonic Toy images" category I guess). I mostly want to make this category so that there's a place for the images in the Sonic Foods article. Maybe I should just make a "Foods" category?

-- Eh, What's up Doc?   ~  DjWindmaster97  18:02, August 27, 2010 (UTC)


 * So what category do you think I should put Merchandise in? I can only think of the "Images" category.
 * -- Eh, What's up Doc?   ~  DjWindmaster97  20:48, August 27, 2010 (UTC)

What the duck happened?
Howdy, Morff. I've been M.I.A. for a while now, and I come back only to see that the Monaco skin on the SNN is M.I.A. as well. What happened? Was there some kind of poll between our users to decide whether or not to use the New Wikia look? How long have I been gone anyway? I feel like I'm the only one who's completely out of it. I'm stuck using Monobook now 'cause I really dont like that new skin, especially 'cause of how the background is blocked by an unsightly white space and how you cant move the text to the right side of the screen. If theres any way for me to choose the Monaco skin, please let me know. This Monobook's crampin' my style.

Oh, and I never got to saying this, so I'll do so now. Congrats on finally being a Featured User. About time the newbies figured out who's the best user around here.

-- Eh, What's up Doc?   ~  DjWindmaster97  05:44, November 13, 2010 (UTC)


 * I've tried those codes to make the changes, and I gotta say, this modded New Wikia skin is not as annoying as it used to be. But it's nowhere NEAR as efficient as Monaco is (was). I miss having that sea of Sonic icons in the background, and without the Recent Activity box, I wont be able to catch vandals as easily anymore. Dang Wikia. Couldn't they have just been like Wikipedia and refined their look instead of completely changing it? Dont people follow the phrase, "If it ain't broken, dont fix it"? But nope. Wikia just had to go and fix it.
 * *Grumbles*

-- Eh, What's up Doc?   ~  DjWindmaster97  00:40, November 15, 2010 (UTC)


 * Oh, okay, I gotcha. I didnt even notice those buttons up there. And I dont get how you can still see the background with this new look. I can only see those Sonic heads when I scroll all the way to the top of the page. Before, I meant that I miss seeing them in that old margin to the left. It's a pain in the neck with this newfangled skin, but we've simply gotta suck it up, make like some Nikes, and just do it.
 * *Grumbles some more*


 * -- Eh, What's up Doc?   ~  DjWindmaster97  05:16, November 16, 2010 (UTC)

== Kagi mizu -Seeya 'round ~ ==

Ah, no. I haven't decided this on my own; the majority of the wiki is in favor of this as well. As for Monaco, Monobook, and Vector; it is indeed possible for us to have those. A lot has happened while you were gone, but to sum it up, Nero's father, the owner of a company with a hosting site, will be migrating a majority of the Sonic wikis, as well as Non-Sonic wikis. This migration could be better compared to "cloning", as Nero's dad will be able to copy every single scrap of data, including ranks, history, and contributions, and place it on an empty "HuskWiki", basically perfectly cloning the SNN, even including Monaco. With this, the wikis don't have to deal with advertizement, all data is maintained, and with the wiki out from under Wikia's thumb, creative freedom with the wiki belongs to the community of the wiki alone. Unfortunately, since we are not paying clients, the wikis have currently been put on the backburner while Nero's dad works with a paying client, hence why we haven't been moved yet. I hope that clears everything up for you.--Kagi mizu -Seeya 'round 19:55, November 4, 2010 (UTC)

(eyes spinning) Okay, hosting is free and as far as I can tell, it's permanent. The website is 12pointdeisgn.com I believe. The reason he's the best bet is because every scrap of our data will be copied so we don't have to start from scratch in any sense, it's entirely free, and we don't have to worry about advertizements. He's said that we can have any wikis we want moved, so I assume the servers can handle it. I'm certain that we don't have to worry about dedication, because this is Nero's dad we're talkng about; Nero is determined to help the wikis, so I'm sure it's okay. As for the rest; ask Nero for the answers.--<font color="#0000FF">Kagi <font color="#FF0000">mizu -<font color="#008000">Seeya <font color="#FFA500">'round 20:36, November 4, 2010 (UTC)

We don't have to suck up to Nero; he knows better. And as I said before, all contributions, privelages, and history will be kept. As for who maintains ultimate control, I suppose that will be Nero's dad possible, or someone else.--<font color="#0000FF">Kagi <font color="#FF0000">mizu -<font color="#008000">Seeya <font color="#FFA500">'round 21:32, November 4, 2010 (UTC)

Well, if the move is successful, the idea is to tear down the old wikis, so the new ones don't get blacklisted by search engines.--<font color="#0000FF">Kagi <font color="#FF0000">mizu -<font color="#008000">Seeya <font color="#FFA500">'round 22:30, November 4, 2010 (UTC)

Well, I bet they didn't think of locking all the pages so only admins can edit them, promoting all Users to admins and having them delete all the articles, then wiping out and/or deleting the MediaWiki coding. I figure if old SNN is gonna go out, it might as well go out with a bang.--<font color="#0000FF">Kagi <font color="#FF0000">mizu -<font color="#008000">Seeya <font color="#FFA500">'round 22:57, November 4, 2010 (UTC)

Nono! The MediaWiki coding is on each and every wiki. It's what allows stuff like editing and archiving. If we take down the MediaWiki coding for Sonic News Network, it will be a total mess. As a total mess, no-one will want to adopt it, and when abandoned, Wikia staff will have to delete the old SNN. Believe me, this might be a bannable offense, but it's not illegal. Besides, if SNN is cutting ties with Wikia, why listen to the Staff anymore?--<font color="#0000FF">Kagi <font color="#FF0000">mizu -<font color="#008000">Seeya <font color="#FFA500">'round 23:12, November 4, 2010 (UTC)

The Wikia staff don't regularly patroll the wikis, and we hardly get any experienced Users not already from SNN anyway. More than likely, the only people who would come here are inexperienced Users with no idea what to do. With the MediaWiki down, Users wouldn't come here as often. Coupled with the fact that SNN is moved, who would bother wanting the old one back?--<font color="#0000FF">Kagi <font color="#FF0000">mizu -<font color="#008000">Seeya <font color="#FFA500">'round 23:29, November 4, 2010 (UTC)

Hey, if SNN is being cloned, then abandoned, why not take down the old Wikia-controlled one? I doubt they'll find out about it, at least for quite a while. And so what if we're banned from old SNN? We won't even be on it anymore, so what does it matter?--<font color="#0000FF">Kagi <font color="#FF0000">mizu -<font color="#008000">Seeya <font color="#FFA500">'round 23:46, November 4, 2010 (UTC)

Let me catch you on one of those first ones; absolutely nothing would be done until the move is completely finished, and we know that it has been a success. Besides Morff, if the current SNN stays, then the non-wiki SNN, the one that most of the Users here will be on, will be blacklisted by search engines, and wno't gain any new members or popularity. That's why something has to be done to the old SNN.--<font color="#0000FF">Kagi <font color="#FF0000">mizu -<font color="#008000">Seeya <font color="#FFA500">'round 15:42, November 5, 2010 (UTC)

First and foremost, as this wiki belongs to the community, it's obvious this would have to be brought up to everyone else, especially since this concerns all of them. Second, we were talking about 58's adminship being rescinded due to her actions and attitude as of late.--<font color="#0000FF">Kagi <font color="#FF0000">mizu -<font color="#008000">Seeya <font color="#FFA500">'round 18:17, November 5, 2010 (UTC)

Yeah, partially cuz I don't have a wikia.css. You saw how your link was red, didn't you?--<font color="#0000FF">Kagi <font color="#FF0000">mizu -<font color="#008000">Seeya <font color="#FFA500">'round 18:43, November 5, 2010 (UTC)

Yeah, and I don't plan to. I refuse to use the skin that Wikia forced on us. Besides, soon enough SNN will be moved, and we won't have to listen to or adhere to Wikia anymore.--<font color="#0000FF">Kagi <font color="#FF0000">mizu -<font color="#008000">Seeya <font color="#FFA500">'round 18:52, November 5, 2010 (UTC)

Pardon me morff, but you have been gone and out of the loop for over a month, while I've been on both SNN and SFW, in the middle of all of this. So, I think I know just a little bit more about the situation than you do. Like for one, the move isn't a risky gamble; if something goes wrong, the original will still be here, and we can try again. Second, we won't be splitting the Userbace, because most everyone on the wiki dislikes and/or hates the new skin, and everyone is for or at least willing to go along with the move.--<font color="#0000FF">Kagi <font color="#FF0000">mizu -<font color="#008000">Seeya <font color="#FFA500">'round 19:05, November 5, 2010 (UTC)

The trashing part I still have to bring up on SNN; the idea was more or less agreed upon for SFW at the very least, so the past could be let go of, and no-one would have to maintain the old SFW that no-one would care about anymore. The moving part has basically been established on my latest blogs, from "SNN's Viewpoint" to "Dissappointment...". It's all been going on for the month you've been gone.--<font color="#0000FF">Kagi <font color="#FF0000">mizu -<font color="#008000">Seeya <font color="#FFA500">'round 19:32, November 5, 2010 (UTC)

Well, I'm going by the same logic 58 did. We've got several Users who are distinctly in favor of this, with next to no opposition to the move. The rest of the Users seem to be willing to go along with the move, or simply don't care.--<font color="#0000FF">Kagi <font color="#FF0000">mizu -<font color="#008000">Seeya <font color="#FFA500">'round 20:24, November 5, 2010 (UTC)

Yeah. Sides, the move has plenty of upsides for SNN.--<font color="#0000FF">Kagi <font color="#FF0000">mizu -<font color="#008000">Seeya <font color="#FFA500">'round 20:34, November 5, 2010 (UTC)

Complete creative freedom, and Wikia having absolutely no control over the wiki are two more.--<font color="#0000FF">Kagi <font color="#FF0000">mizu -<font color="#008000">Seeya <font color="#FFA500">'round 20:46, November 5, 2010 (UTC)

.....Do I really have to be specific? *waves hand to the skin*--<font color="#0000FF">Kagi <font color="#FF0000">mizu -<font color="#008000">Seeya <font color="#FFA500">'round 21:09, November 5, 2010 (UTC)

Well, we're limited on what skins we can and can't use. Outside of Wikia, hell we could make our own skin!--<font color="#0000FF">Kagi <font color="#FF0000">mizu -<font color="#008000">Seeya <font color="#FFA500">'round 21:16, November 5, 2010 (UTC)

It was only an example.--<font color="#0000FF">Kagi <font color="#FF0000">mizu -<font color="#008000">Seeya <font color="#FFA500">'round 21:25, November 5, 2010 (UTC)

Yeah, I did the thing and it is better than before. Still not as good as the wiki used to be, but better, thanks for that. So yeah, this move thing is one of those crazy cranberries I mentioned before. So at first an offer to buy the wiki came from FTCR.com or find the computer room, whatever you want to call it. No one ever asked me about it, but I found them to be a very ambitious website with plans on becoming big like the Sonic Stadium or Sonic Retro. I was all for joining them, thinking we'd finally get a little respect in the Sonic community. But now, reading over your talk page, it appears someone rejected that offer and now want some user's Dad to sponsor the site? That seems pathetic and lame and I'd rather stay where we are. Sonictoast 16:38, November 6, 2010 (UTC)


 * Thanks. Sorry I blew it with the tournament updates this week, leaving three of the previous winners up, I guess I just got so wrapped up in the numbers I completely forgot about the names. Kagi pitched in with the Tournament a little. I finally got a new job about a month ago, the job is great, but I haven't been able to be on SNN too much lately. But I for one am really glad you are back. You are like a guardian over SNN keeping things in order. I think if you ever left permanently, this wiki would fall apart. Anyway, sorry I'm being kind of ranty, it's late where I am and it has been a long day of work.

So anyway, about this move, I don't think we should be jumping into it yet. I think we should call a meeting with all the active admins. In this meeting we should thoroughly discuss the pros and cons of moving and maybe even vote on the matter. If the pros outweigh the cons and a majority of the admins are for it, we should go ahead and move, but if it is the opposite, we should stay. This is really something I think we should all do together, not have some of us stay and some of us move and have two identical wikis. It should be all or nothing. What are your thoughts on this idea?Sonictoast 05:34, November 11, 2010 (UTC)

Tournament Changeovers
Hey Morff, Could you do changeovers this week, possibly for the next two weeks? My wife is 8 months and 3 weeks pregnant. So if the baby doesn't come this weekend, he'll definitely be here next week. So yeah, If she goes into labor, I'm pretty sure SNN will be the last thing on my mind. Sonictoast 06:56, November 26, 2010 (UTC)


 * I like that you related the poll to the tourney. It will drive more traffic to the tournament and points out how cool it is the two have been randomly paired off like that.  Also, great job on the changeovers.  No baby yet on my side, but we have a good feeling about tonight.  Sonictoast 01:57, November 30, 2010 (UTC)

just wanted to tell you. My son was born yesterday morning. Everything went well. 8 pounds 13 ounces. Sonictoast 21:07, December 2, 2010 (UTC)

Great job on the tournament changeovers. It's amazing that we are halfway through round 2 already. anyway, I can do the changeovers this coming week (monday the 13th), but could you do it the following week (monday the 20th)? I will be out of town at my wife's parent's house and I will have little to no internet access. Sonictoast 04:23, December 7, 2010 (UTC)

I'd hate to be a bother, but the cobwebs need to be cleaned off my adminship nomination. 21:03, November 3, 2010 (UTC)

58SlugDrones!
The script is downloadable here: http://www.x-cult.org/games/39/Sonic_the_Hedgehog/1244/Game_Script/

However I didn't download it, I have the fear it may contain a virus or some sort. But Sonic Retro has the content written in Blaze's page in the trivia section. Anyways, I would appreciate it if you would tell me what underendowed means, I can't find it in the dictionary. Never mind.--58SlugDrones! 16:11, September 29, 2010 (UTC)

I was thinking of changing the color of the character and videogame info-boxes to a more deeper shade of blue. Can I test it?--58SlugDrones! 09:42, November 20, 2010 (UTC)

I did change the color directly on it's page (without the sandbox), the change came on the it's page but not on other pages. Do you know why?--58SlugDrones! 09:51, November 20, 2010 (UTC)

I see, thank you. I just feel doubtful about changing the template because Kagi always stops me.--58SlugDrones! 10:00, November 20, 2010 (UTC)

Heh, thanks again. I guess everyone does know that Kagi starts scolding me resulting me in trouble. It's embarrassing.--58SlugDrones! 10:07, November 20, 2010 (UTC)

I will always try to change this wiki I can't help myself. I want it to look more Sonic-like than Wikia-like. I want this place to sound more independent than to make readers think that we are under wikia I want this site to look professional to the next-level. I have very cool and complicated HTML codes for the Monaco, unfortunately it is gone but when we move, I would like to test them. Apparently a month ago I tried, but none would work, I don't know what the problem is. Perhaps you can help me sometime when you and I are free, I can see that you are really good at HTML. I have always wanted to discuss that with you. Care to help sometime?--58SlugDrones! 12:16, November 20, 2010 (UTC)

Well, you are better than me. I just know the code but I can't fix it, this happens with anything I do.--58SlugDrones! 03:40, November 21, 2010 (UTC)

You are right. We don't have it. I think I can fix this up, thanks.

Uh, do you know how to implement it? Because I do not get it.--58SlugDrones! 13:01, November 21, 2010 (UTC)

"Kagi doesn't like change period"

 * ) I admit, I don't particularly like change, that's true. But the problem I have with 58's actions is that she changes templates, infoboxes, and all of that how she sees fit, without even notifying the rest of the wiki. In other words, she makes a completely unilateral decision regardless of how the wiki might feel. I really have a problem with her doing this, repeatedly, because a wiki is a community, where everyone is supposed to be involved in making changes to things. If you recall, FFF once gave LB the authorization to change the infoboxes how he (LB) wanted to. This resulted in several Users being furious, because not only was the design gaudy and generally disliked or hated, but it was done with anyone even being told about the change. On SFW, fights would break out because the admins made decisions without letting the rest of the wiki have a say in it. I don't like change in general, but I really don't like it when it's done without anyone else getting a say in the matter. It undermines our fellow Users, gives the message that their opinion doesn't matter, and runs the risk of causing conflict. I especially don't like such actions taking place here on SNN, because I learned that admins are supposed to act on behalf of the community- not their own opinions- from SNN. I have continuously tried to explain this to 58; so she'll understand, and also not runthe risk of being flamed by the community for her actions, but she refuses to understand, still acting on her own opinions alone. That is why I suggested her adminship be rescinded.
 * ) Please tell 58 that if she has a problem with me she needs to say it to my face, because something I hate even more than what I described above, is people talking about their issues with me behind my back, rather than having the guts to say it to my face.--<font color="#0000FF">Kagi <font color="#FF0000">mizu -<font color="#008000">Seeya <font color="#FFA500">'round 21:59, November 21, 2010 (UTC)

Yeah, I know that. Ofcourse I won't do it now, I know this place is moving so I should prevent myself from this. I am planning to do this after the move. Don't worry, I think I have this under-control.

By the way. I know these two really large and complicated HTMLs that can change this website forever, well, in a good way. Apparently they are confusing to understand, and even if I think I have understood, I try it but it fails. With no change at all. But they are only for Monaco. I want to show them to you but since we don't have Monaco I don't think I can explain well to you on what they can do. What me to try tell you what they do or are you too busy?

Oh yeah, I won't be around very much. Again. I have my mocks (if you know what they are) from the school for my preparation of the Cambridge Exams. I will be taking a Cambridge Board Exam in Asia not England on May 2011, so there are really busy months for me. These papers are my future and I have to prepare, so I guess I will be cutting off SNN soon. You can inform others if they complain on why am I not around, since I am only telling you.--58SlugDrones! 13:33, November 22, 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for wishing me luck! I appreciate it! Good luck to you too! I am not sure on when I will be gone though, perhaps during December if things aren't too serious. But I'll let you know on time. As for the jobs, sure I will give them to you (uh... you mean the two HTMLs I was talking about right?). By the way when are your exams, which subjects are you taking and which grade are you in? Just asking because it's good to hear the someone else in this site as his exams too.--58SlugDrones! 13:59, November 22, 2010 (UTC)

The reason I revert her edits is because of both reasons; I don't like the change, and I really don't like her changing stuff without talking to anyone. And rather than just giving everyone a little surprise, and running the risk of getting people ticked, she could make a blog, or put the possible change on the talkpage of said template. I keep getting on her back about this not because I dislike her, but because I'd rather not see her get flamed when she ends up making a particularly big change without letting the community know. These templates are things everyone has to use and look at, so everyone should have a say in how they are or aren't changed. Otherwise, Users could end up thinking that their opinions don't matter, and that they have to go along with whatever's decided. Something I find perturbing is that Users seem to already think that, considering many people not getting involved in wiki affairs. It's either that they think their opinion doesn't count, or they just don't care. I just don't want 58 getting her butt bitten off for her changing stuff without peoples' permission; it's not just templates even. She's also on several occasions messed with the MediaWiki coding without telling anyone beforehand, which has never gone well (i.e. It messes with the wiki, and I have to change it back). Like I said before, if she keeps going, she'll think she can change whatever she wants without telling people, and that's gonna get her fried one of these days. The reason I'm so staunchly against changing things, then seeing what people think of it, is because 1) It runs the risk of really ticking people off and riling them up, and 2) if people don't like it, then it ends up being a waste of work and effort. I've got nothing against her personally, but 58's actions could end up getting her on the bad side of most people on SNN.

In fact, there are already some people she's ticked off or upset since she's gained her adminship. Lev says that her personality changed for the worse when she became an admin, and Gen really doesn't like her actions and attitude as of late. Let's just look at how she treated Mult even! On top of that, the user Bunnyboo500 seems to have gotten on her bad side, judging by the message she (Bunnyboo) left Shelly. Like I said, I personally have nothing against her, but her actions lately seem fueled by her own ambitions to change the wiki, rather then helping out and protecting the wiki. How many admins have you seen try to make big changes to the wiki right after gaining adminship, without already trying to do so beforehand?--<font color="#0000FF">Kagi <font color="#FF0000">mizu -<font color="#008000">Seeya <font color="#FFA500">'round 15:39, November 22, 2010 (UTC)

The reason I revert her edits is because we all have to look at and deal with the templates; she has no right to change them how she alone sees fit. No-one has the right to make unilateral decisions like that, and the fact that 58 continues to do so despite my repeated explanations about this, is what's really annoying me. The templates, infoboxes, and coding don't belong to her; they belong to the community as a whole, and as such the community should say when and how things are changed. It's much like how Wikia Central forced this new look upon the wikis.--<font color="#0000FF">Kagi <font color="#FF0000">mizu -<font color="#008000">Seeya <font color="#FFA500">'round 19:44, November 22, 2010 (UTC)

(frustrated groan) You're not getting it Morff, and the sarcasm really doesn't help. You created those, out of neccessity, with no previous version of what you created. Alright, look at it this way: some admin suddenly decides to re-write the rules of the wiki, without letting the rest of the community know or make a decision on it. That would obviously piss people off, because everyone has to live with the rules, not just the person who changed them. Sure, they can easily be undone, or they could even be for the better, but it doesn't change the fact that it was done without consulting the rest of the community. it sends a message that the opinion of the wiki's community doesn't matter, that their opinion doesn't count when it comes to the wiki, and that they don't have a say in anything; that only the admins make decisions, and everyone else just has to live with it. Lately it seems like the community doesn't care or doesn't want part in making decisions, right? Well 58 keeps sending the message that "I don't care what the rest of the wiki thinks, I think the [template/wiki/page] looks better this way, so everyone else just has to live with it", intentionally or otherwise. It may not seem like a big deal to you, but do you really wanna risk allowing 58 to just do what she alone sees fit, regardless of what it says to the rest of the wiki? We want people to be involved, right? To help make decisions so that the wiki can be the best for everyone, right? Well if that's the case, then we have to show that the opinion of the community does actually mean something, and is actually valued. Allowing 58 to continue changing everything to what she alone sees fit says that not only does the community's opinion count, but the opinion of her fellow admins doesn't count either.--<font color="#0000FF">Kagi <font color="#FF0000">mizu -<font color="#008000">Seeya <font color="#FFA500">'round 21:19, November 22, 2010 (UTC)

That's the point, she isn't making these changes on behalf of or for the members of the wiki; she's changing the templates and messing with the coding because she thinks it needs to be changed; she's not consulting the rest of us about this. Regardless of whether or not she thinks it's best for the wiki doesn't matter; what matters is the majority opinion of the wiki. If she'd just stop acting like she's free to change whatever the hell she wants, and actually listen to the rest of us, I wouldn't have a problem. Because then, the community would be deciding which templates are changed, and how, instead of just a single admin.--<font color="#0000FF">Kagi <font color="#FF0000">mizu -<font color="#008000">Seeya <font color="#FFA500">'round 22:16, November 22, 2010 (UTC)

Well, actually I am not British. I am American but I don't live there I live in Asia, in a country where American Education is rare. I take Science subjects like Biology Chemistry and Physics but I am not taking those in May 2011. I am taking History, Geography and Islamiat. I will take Bio, Chem, Phy, Eng and Math in 2012.

Sure you can take the jobs! I would be glad! --58SlugDrones! 02:29, November 23, 2010 (UTC)

I am very grateful for your support. If it weren't for you would we have this skin? Remember at that time LB and Kagi didn't want a skin but you supported my idea. If it weren't for you would I have tried changing the headings for the main-page? Thanks alot Supermorff. Thankyou for talking a long conversation through with Kagi. Thanks for everything! You made my place in this wiki, if it weren't for your support I wouldn't have tried to improve the wiki at all. You always did let me. Thanks alot.--58SlugDrones! 11:35, November 23, 2010 (UTC)

I don't want people asking me, I want people asking the rest of the wiki so as to get a majority opinion before making changes we all have to live with.--<font color="#0000FF">Kagi <font color="#FF0000">mizu -<font color="#008000">Seeya <font color="#FFA500">'round 18:48, November 23, 2010 (UTC)

If we made it clear that user opinion is wanted and valued, perhaps they would respond. When I brought up non-Sonic characters on the SNN talkpage, asking for everyone's opinion on the matter, people got involved.--<font color="#0000FF">Kagi <font color="#FF0000">mizu -<font color="#008000">Seeya <font color="#FFA500">'round 18:54, November 23, 2010 (UTC)

Yeah I am going GCSE. I am doing IGCSE which is the latest format, I am in year two (IGCSE is for 3 years) so, technically I am in 9th grade, I never knew you were so big. I also agree, Kagi hadn't got his mind changed one bit.--58SlugDrones! 10:32, November 24, 2010 (UTC)

I have not finalized on when I am leaving. I may be gone for months. Well, you can say that I won't be active here at all in 2011. From January to June I will certainly not be here on SNN. I might come back in the beginning of June if I lose my chance to go to USA and attend E3. But I won't be around this weekend, and the Weekly Poll needs to be changed. Well, right now my condition is "coming and going" over and over again on this site. I guess you should take my jobs now, I won't be doing them from today. Good luck, here is what you do:


 * Make a Weekly Sonic-related poll.
 * Try coming up with News and Updates going around this website or the World of Sonic.
 * Inform anyone who tries to send me message that I am not available and I will reply later. (I suggest you do this later)

I guess that's pretty much it. I am looking forward for your participation, buddy!--58SlugDrones! 10:49, November 24, 2010 (UTC)

That "pointless red tape" makes sure that, regardless of the outcome, everyone knows that they were at least able to speak their opinion on the matter, and everyone can be satisfied with the fact that they were at least heard out. Something that can seriously sway any future matters SNN may have. In addition, there's also the impression being made on Users who could very well be the next admins of this site. I know it made an impression on me when I learned from the admins here that everyone's opinions should be heard.--<font color="#0000FF">Kagi <font color="#FF0000">mizu -<font color="#008000">Seeya <font color="#FFA500">'round 20:24, November 24, 2010 (UTC)

The reason I revert those edits are because big changes typically effect everyone, so they really shouldn't be done with note beforehand, and a consensus opinion about said change(s), so as to minimize the risk of negative reactions and possible fights.--<font color="#0000FF">Kagi <font color="#FF0000">mizu -<font color="#008000">Seeya <font color="#FFA500">'round 21:07, November 24, 2010 (UTC)

I see you have changed the poll. But I have got to ask you, why did you put up a Poll on the Home-page that is already in the Character Tournament? Why do we need two of them?--58SlugDrones! 10:49, November 29, 2010 (UTC)

Yeah, I meant two of the same polls. Anyways, I do not think we need two. But I can say it is sort of a good idea for getting the Character Tournament more attention, not a bad idea. Do as you wish.--58SlugDrones! 06:26, November 30, 2010 (UTC)

Christmas Background
Hey Supermorff. I have put up the new skin and color schemes of the website for the Christmas theme. Thus, I put up DiscoDuck's idea of putting a logo on the page. Can you see the new skin? I can see it.--58SlugDrones! 12:12, December 5, 2010 (UTC)

Uh, I think those articles should be deleted straight away. I mean, look at all of that fan-fiction! He should be in the Sonic Fanon Wiki if he had to add this much of work. And now we can't keep all his work in our website when not in use. So, I guess all of that should be deleted. What do you think?--58SlugDrones! 14:03, December 5, 2010 (UTC)

I understand. But I don't think anybody would even care to discuss on these pages whether they should be deleted or not. You've been on this for a month, right? Then hasn't anybody had a say in this?--58SlugDrones! 14:14, December 5, 2010 (UTC)

I thought I was the only one who thought that no one in the website cares about what goes on here. Anyways, though you have given them an opportunity for them to have a say on whether these should be deleted, they haven't said anything. So, if you and I agree to delete these then I guess they should be removed because we are the only ones who care.--58SlugDrones! 14:42, December 5, 2010 (UTC)

What about the ones you didn't tag today but tagged earlier? Did anybody say anything about those?--58SlugDrones! 14:47, December 5, 2010 (UTC)

I'd like to know who said that. I am also curious to know which pages are you tagging that you think users will care?--58SlugDrones! 14:52, December 5, 2010 (UTC)

Hm, indeed quite interesting to see what would happen. That girl has many friends. If there are lots to tag then I can help if you want, don't worry, I won't cry if you refuse my help.--58SlugDrones! 15:02, December 5, 2010 (UTC)

No need to thank me. I wouldn't mind it even if you would never reply that message, that's because you are a nice person.--58SlugDrones! 15:07, December 5, 2010 (UTC) 

A simple question...
To introduce myself, I am a writer for a media culture magazine that covers animation, video games, music, and manga/graphic novels and I was wondering if it would be possible if I could use the blue and white sonic background you designed for this site as the background for an upcomming multi-part article I am writing about the history of Sonic the Hedgehog. I will be more than willing to give full credit to you for the background if allowed.

how
hate to bother you again how do i fuse pics for my fan chracter-Shadow ruler

supermorff, i need to know how to turn a user into a admin. im the founder of the secret agent clank wiki, and i want to turn ultimatedude127 into an admin because he is a very good user there. he has great edits -- Mystery Link. 01:55, December 8, 2010 (UTC)

Please change the Weekly Poll.--58SlugDrones! 19:59, December 10, 2010 (UTC)

Hm, I used to change it on Friday. Oh right then, as you wish.--58SlugDrones! 05:06, December 11, 2010 (UTC)

Yeah, I knew that. It's alright you don't need to explain, it's no longer my job now, so it's all up to you. I just get worried about this website not getting updated. The reason I gave you this job because it is not fair if I only do the polls, rather I should give other admins a chance too.--58SlugDrones! 14:14, December 11, 2010 (UTC)

Monaco
What do do you mean we will have Monaco back soon? 00:14, December 15, 2010 (UTC)

Im sure that you wrote that we are getting monaco back soon when you un-deleted the Monaco side-bar when Kagimizu deleted it. Mabey I didint read it right.-- 17:03, December 15, 2010 (UTC)

Vandal
No disrespect Supermorff, but don't you think that 3 Days wasn't enough? He's been repeatedly harassing user here since November, this isn't his first offense. -- 22:09, December 18, 2010 (UTC)

1. Thanks for seeing my point.

2. Also, he might have created an account to bypass the ban, the account name is Myself1. 22:17, December 18, 2010 (UTC)