User talk:Supermorff

Adding categories to Dark Valley, you say??
Well... thanks. I'd clearly dropped the ball and forgotten them there. But in due course, I'd like to ask your opinion on the Locations vs. Game stages categories.

You would think they would overlap lots, wouldn't you? And, indeed, they do. What I've been doing (when I remember to add them at all!) is stick "Game stages" on everything that is... well, a named level or zone. And stick Locations on things when they become MORE than just one level - like Green Hill, which has been in many, many games, and so clearly becomes a Plot Element instead of just a random stage. Also, Soleanna, which isn't a specific named level ever, but is clearly a location.

Which generally boils down to: if it's NEVER been a game stage, it gets just location. If it's ONCE been a game stage, it gets Game Stage. If it's been a game stage more than once, it gets Location AND Game stage.

Do you think this makes any sense at all? I would like to try and hammer out (at some point) an SNN "best practice procedure" for Game Stage category vs. Location categoty, and so your sage thoughts on the matter would be much appreciated. :D The Doctor... IS IN Molten Scandium  00:28, 3 April 2009 (UTC)


 * I think there are two things to consider here: namely the short-term and long-term methods for dealing with this little difficulty. Short-term, your solution is pretty good. It means at the very least that every game stage is categorised as such, and every location is either in the Locations category or one of its subcats.
 * Long-term, I'm still slightly conflicted over the best way to deal with it. Fortunately, being long-term, we have some time yet to ponder it. I assure you I will give this some thought.
 * Oh, the one thing I would point out is that some "game stages" clearly aren't "locations" in the usual sense: e.g. Babylon Guardian is a character and boss stage, but the location where the boss battle takes place appears to be called the Digital Dimension. So that's something to keep an eye on in future as well. -- Supermorff 15:56, 3 April 2009 (UTC)

A query I have
Hello Supermorff,

I've been informed from Kagimizu that I should seek a mod about a query I have instead of actually trying to edit the articles themselves so I simply chose you out of random because I can't seem to find anyone in charge of this wiki as a whole admin.

Anyways, this topic is about the trivia sections on this site. I've been here at SNN for some time (I believe since June) and think this Sonic wiki is a good idea. A place where every fan can input info they find. I come to this site often to get info and listings. It's all good except for one section: trivia. When I look at the trivia sections, it's a complete mess. There is information in those sections on almost every page with trivia that should not belong. Some of them are fan speculations, others are hypothesis and guesses, and some are just dumb and pointless. At this time, I thought someone was not taking care of this and all this info was inputted by someone who had no idea what they were doing or what belong in the article or not. So I decided to edit them myself and clean up the trivia sections that had information not necessary. Well to my surprise, they kept reappearing. Every page I went, the info kept popping up. At first I thought it was some stubborn user but then it turned out it was none other than Kagimizu, a mod. It would be understandable if it was some user who did not know how to input info into a trivia section but if a mod approves of such info, then we got a problem here.

I'm a fan of the trivia sections. I love them because you get even more in depth info from the subject in question that you would not learn formally. But when I come to SNN, I am displeased to learn that almost anything is put into the trivia sections. It's as if no one knows how to do a trivia section properly and assume anything can be put in.

A trivia section is a section of an article where info that cannot be placed on the main article is placed on it's own section. This info is not important enough to be a part of the main section but still useful enough to be known so it should not be omitted. The information that goes into a trivia section adds and expands the article and gives more insight, knowledge, and description to the subject. Wikipedia's guidelines for trivia state that it's info that can not fit anywhere and the editor should try to look for a place to put it in. In other words, trivia is the last thing that should be worked on because you want to search for a place to fit the info on the article and add to it. If it can't be added, then it's considered trivial and thus, goes into it's own section.

But this does not apply to SNN. When I see an trivia section, I am seeing information that is quiet useless to know about such as comparing one character to another. I don't understand why I need to know about a trait that is more coincidental than it is about the development of the character. If one character has a trait that is similar to another, such as Blaze being similar to Knuckles in the fact that they are guardians of certain emeralds, then you must ask yourself "Why is this important to the article?" In the example I showed, how does that information help the Blaze article expand more and give insight to her. If it was stated by a employee at Sega that they got inspiration from Knuckles when modeling Blaze, than that would be considered trivia since you would not be able to fit it into the article itself but is important to the understanding of Blaze's development. But if it's just a coincidence that Blaze so happens to be like Knuckles in only that they share that trait and there is nothing to back up that they both share such a common feature besides it being a coincidence, than that is not trivia because it does not help the expand the article and it's pretty much just an observation someone made.

There are many common mistakes that are added to the trivia sections. Others being fan speculations, good obsevations that are not informative enough to warrant research, what people "think" might be, and stuff that is not informative at all and are just comments. These may be interesting to know but when I read them, they didn't add to the article I was reading and didn't help my research. It felt like I was reading a persons comment rather than an excerpt of the subject. If the item doesn't give you applied knowledge, it should not be included.

I believe that the trivia sections need a serious clean up. If a mod approves it, then that means that no one here knows how trivia should be done. Serious guidelines should be done for trivia and what it is, what should go in it, and so on. The other info is not important to be warranted as research. Though I have thought about why a mod would approve of it, I come to the conclusion that they consider it important to know. I came to this because I remember I edited out a bad trivia item when I was editing articles. When it was brought back though, that item was not. So there is some attention being put to the trivia sections but no real guideline. That is why I propose there be a new section: miscellaneous. Just what it means, anything and everything else that doesn't even fit in trivia. While trivia SHOULD still cover the article's items that are not important to be in the article itself but still important enough to be known, miscellaneous is just information that is not really important to know but have been observed and might be of interest one way or another. Observations that have bee noted like comparing one character to another (especially when the other character is not even from Sega) is not really trivia but can be put into miscellaneous. I think it would clean up the trivia section and make it more neat.

So that is my post. Sorry if it's huge but it should show you that I am serious about the trivia sections. I love them and hate to see this wiki mishandle them just because people don't understand what trivia means. Just because trivia means info that cannot be inserted into the main article, it does not mean ANYTHING can be placed under it. It should still contain information that adds to the article in a small way but gives you a bit more information about the subject that is necessary to know about. Anything that is simply observed or coincidences are not trivia unless it is backed up by a source of information that is not hearsay or guessing. If you want to have that information, then a good idea would be to make a separate section for them. This will help keep the article in order so when you get to the trivia section, it won't be a jumble mess and you will be able to tell what's actual fact and what is a possibility. --TKGB 07:27, October 7, 2009 (UTC)
 * Well I'm glad that you agree and was surprised to know that someone else has a concern about it. But that still doesn't solve anything. Isn't there anything that can be done about this? Simply editing it won't do since someone will just end up undoing it.--TKGB 00:28, October 8, 2009 (UTC)

Actually, that's not entirely true. If we simply keep an eye on the articles and remove uneeded info, that should really clean up the Trivia.--Kagi mizu -Seeya  'round ~ 00:36, October 8, 2009 (UTC)
 * Well that would be ideal except that people don't understand what trivia is here. There is no guideline for that in this wiki and people just keep posting items unrelated to being trivia and it keeps being approved. So when you say "uneeded", what does that mean here? That's why I'm proposing two sections. That would be ideal to keep stuff that is still revelant to the subject and info that is are just hypothesis that people have (i.e. "...because of this, it is believed that...").--TKGB 00:47, October 8, 2009 (UTC)

Well, Trivia already has its own "section" on pages, but seperate pages is too far. The way I see it, if the trivia is notable and relevant, it's fine by me. For example, some new trivia that was added to Amy's page was that "Amy is currently the only female hedgehog in the games". Stuff like that seems reasonable to me.--Kagi mizu -Seeya  'round ~ 00:52, October 8, 2009 (UTC)
 * See, that kind of information is not trivia. Firstly, what I suggested was not a new page but a new category for this kind of thing. Second, I don't think you understand the meaning of trivia. As I've said on the original long post I made for Supermorff, trivia is information that aids the article. It helps expand the article on knowledge about the subject. Don't you think that pointing out that Amy is the only female hedgehog is too loose to be considered helpful. If you approve of that, how about "Amy is currently the only pink female character". How about "Amy is currently the only character who wields a hammer". Or "Amy is currently the only character that was kidnapped by Metal Sonic" and "Amy is currently the only hedgehog whose design has changed drastically"? You have to ask yourself if the information is helpful in research and development of the character both ingame and real world, not just observations.

If you still can't understand what I mean, consider another subject. Let me use English as an example. Look at this site:

http://www.sentex.net/~ajy/facts/words.html

The site contains many information that can be considered trivia. So by your approval, one could put "As of today, the letter Y is the only one that can be used as both a vowel and a consonant." Yeah, thats nice but it's pretty obvious that most people know about it so it doesn't need to be written down. I hope you understand what I mean. --TKGB 06:13, October 8, 2009 (UTC)

In my books, if you have several strings of trivia related to each other, then those need to be clumped together to form a new section, as was the case with Silver when I first came here. Trivia is my biggest crib with this wikia and I'm a reglaur visitor here. I raised this issue recently, because Silver's trivia section was massive. I listed elsewhere several points and problems with trivia. In the end it comes down to this: Can it fit elsewhere on the page? If yes, then it doesn't belong in trivia. If not, then it belongs in trivia.

As a experience wikia peep, this wikia can be off putting at times, but I come here because I have long term issues with wikipedia (used to be a wikipedian until 2 years ago or so). At the very least, what someone needs to do is look at the largest section on the page other then trivia (not including galleries) and ask "Is the trivia section bigger then this?". If yes, something needs to be done ASAP, as I had to do with Silver's page. Regardless, I'm happy to see it finally being discussed, but there seems to be a problem with controlling it. If you have guidelines for trivia, that would help, if not, perhaps its time something was done. One-Winged Hawk 15:16, October 8, 2009 (UTC)

Re: User masthead
Hey Supermorff. Sorry for the late reply. I just tested this code and it worked, so just add it to Monaco.css and hard refresh (Ctrl+F5).

color: #000000 !important; }
 * 1) page_tabs a {

color: #BA0000 !important; }
 * 1) page_tabs a.new {

background-color: #FFFFFF !important; }
 * 1) page_tabs li.selected a, #page_tabs li.selected a.new {

background-color: #EEEEEE !important; }
 * 1) page_tabs li a, #page_tabs li a.new {

body.masthead-regular #page_bar, body.masthead-special #page_bar { border-bottom: none; }

While we're talking about css colors, I was wondering if you'd want to make the text on the header buttons (GAMING and MORE) more visible. They're quite hard to read. If you want to change that text color, edit this item in Monaco.css:

/* this makes the background of those 'pill' buttons blue also */ .headerMenuButton dt, .headerMenuButton dd { background-image: url(http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/help/images/3/3a/Sapphire_header_button.png); color: #808080; } Just change #808080 to white or a light gray (such as #DDDDDD, #CCCCCC, etc.) to match the color of the little down arrow. Let me know if you have any problems or need help with anything else. JoePlay ( talk ) 21:30, December 29, 2009 (UTC)


 * If you use Firefox, then Firebug is a very useful tool for troubleshooting css code used on the Monaco skin. JoePlay ( talk ) 19:57, December 30, 2009 (UTC)

Regarding Eggman's eyes…
Of course that video showed Eggman's eyes. Very clearly it did, even. The camera was, at multiple times, at an angle that cleary revealed his eyes. Here's a screenshot someone took also showing it. Herman2000 19:41, January 14, 2010 (UTC)

Well, I disagree there, indeed. If it's in the game, it's obviously canon. Herman2000 01:19, January 15, 2010 (UTC)

Sir Frances Charles. His full name was revealed in SatAM. Trust me, I wouldn't lie. Watch SatAm to comfirm my sources though I can't remember which episode. Sonic &amp; Scrab  Master

Sky Babylon
Dude. I need help. I'm trying to create the Sky Babylon page but it said that I can't because of something about Multiverseman, Ip adress, and banned. Everytime I try to create that page, it happens. Sonic &amp; Scrab  Master

Werehog's Trivia
Thanks man. I O U one. Anyway, what do u think about the wrehog's trivia. 58SlugDrones is trying to remove most of it. Sonic &amp; Scrab  Master

Brandondork9999
Supermorff. The WikiKnights of the SNN Table need your help. Brandondork9999 is vandalizing the Mystic Mansion page again. I don't think he's learned his lesson yet. I think you should "put him in summer school". Sonic &amp; Scrab  Master


 * Hey Supermorff. I came here to talk about something on SNN thats been buggin me for awhile now.... It's those dang Song Connections on most of the vocal song pages. I think that they're pretty much pointless, as one would only visit an article about a song to either listen to it or look up the lyrics. Anyone with a brain could figure out those connections to the character if they know who the theme song belongs to. For example: His World: Theme of Sonic the Hedgehog - Its title obviously advertises it as Sonic's theme, so its lyrics are unmistakably about him and make connections to his character. Another example: Unknown From M.E. - The lyrics are written as if it's like Knuckles himself is talking (because he obviously is), so clearly one would know everything connects to him. Whoever wrote it (Sonic &amp; Scrab Master I think) might as well have wrote:

"His duty's to protect Master Emerald diamond"-Knuckles' duty to protect the Master Emerald (doy!)


 * Not only are they kinda useless, but they're also kinda poorly written. I know someone probly put a lot of work into writing those Song Connections, so I dont want to go on an editing spree removing the Connections on the several song articles that have them, as to not cause a huge argument, so I wanted to get your input on the matter first.

 I AM THE LAW! ~ DjWindmaster97  22:04, April 8, 2010 (UTC)

Hey man. I took a little break from the SNN, which is why I didnt reply to your message right away. I've got a plan for those Song Connections that will probly solve everything without some incident. I'll write them in paragraphs like you said, as a description of the song. It will be a lot of work but I can do it. And another thing.... I think the Bentley Jones song article "U Won't 4get Me" should be deleted, 'cause I researched and I dont think it has anything to do with All-Stars Racing, besides being on the same album as the game's main theme. I think the song is just a regular main-stream song, not a track made for the game.

 I AM THE LAW! ~ DjWindmaster97  21:20, April 13, 2010 (UTC)


 * Hey Super. I havent been around as much lately due to my computer (actually my family's computer) running really slow recently. The Norton antivirus security expired and the computer has the notorious Windows Vista OS (I bet that would explain why its so slow now). If it had not been for that I would have been probly halfway done with editing those Song Connections by now, as it takes me forever to edit pages and undo the work of vandals with this piece of junk computer (desprately need my own laptop). I'm just rambling now, the real reason I'm here is that I was wondering if the SNN had a template like this one or this for footnotes in tables. If not, I'd like to make them for things like the tables in the All-Stars Racing page.

 I AM THE LAW! ~ DjWindmaster97  03:48, April 22, 2010 (UTC)

Hey there Super. I saw that you were online from the Recent Activity box, so I'll use this opportunity to leave a message. And man, I gotta tell ya, your edits are fast! Its as if Sonic himself is zipping back and forth between articles, editing them at supersonic speed. Do you use Firefox?

Well anyways, I've gotten started on the paragraph-izing of the Song Connections on His World and Unknown From M.E., so check those out to see if they're okay. I had a little encounter with S&amp;SM when I edited the "Unknown From M.E." article, and it turns out he was the one making the song connections. However, he understood my reasons for revising them when I explained, and said that he only made them 'cause he saw something similar at the Spyro Wiki. Also, I've been trying to upload screenshots from Sonic 4, but the files keep ending up corrupted. You can see them at the Speedy Deletion page.

-- Eh, What's up Doc?   ~  DjWindmaster97  19:30, May 8, 2010 (UTC)

Templates
Well, I ended up creating the new Templates for the footnotes, 'cause when I used the existing one, the sidenote appeared under the table multiple times. But I made a little mistake.... It looks okay at first glance on a table in an article, but if you were to click on the reference in the table, it somehow takes you to the top of the page instead of to the footnote under the table. The Template:Footnote works fine, but theres an error with the Template:Ref. Here's its code:


 * 

Can you tell me if I did anything wrong?

 I AM THE LAW! ~ DjWindmaster97  00:31, April 23, 2010 (UTC)


 * You can see the problem with the Ref template at the Sandbox. It's just that when you press on the little letter inside the table that is supposed to go to the footnote at the bottom of the table, it instead takes you to the top of the page or does nothing at all. I think it has something to do with this part of the template:

|[#endnote_]}}

 I AM THE LAW! ~ DjWindmaster97  20:53, April 29, 2010 (UTC)

Hey Super. I've tried to fix the Ref template according to instructions on the documentations at Wikipedia, but I havent had any success. I even tried using the template only once in that table at the Sandbox to see if it would work, but it still refuses to do anything. At least the Note template works perfectly fine. I dont get it.... I know its not my browser causing the problem 'cause it works fine at Wikipedia's All-Stars Racing article. And it links to where its supposed to but still does nothing. For example: I right-click on the little Ref letter to copy its link. Then I paste the link of the Ref in my search bar (I have Internet Explorer 8) and I can see that it is the link thats supposed to take me to the footnote:

Link of Ref in SNN:  #endnote_a

Link of Ref in Wikipedia:

 #endnote_a

You can see that their structure is basically the same, but only the Wikipedia link does what its supposed to do. I dunno, but this constant failure is making me sad, so I'm gonna quit for now. -- Eh, What's up Doc? ~ DjWindmaster97  03:27, May 1, 2010 (UTC)

Supermorff.... You are, THE MAN. I'm not sure as to what you did, but thanks a million! So it was the Template:Note the whole time, huh? Who woulda thought.... So I'll get to adding the templates on the tables that need them when I get the chance, 'cause I really cant right now. But seriously, thanks again! --Eh, What's up Doc? ~ DjWindmaster97  18:24, May 1, 2010 (UTC)

Hey SuperMorff how do you try to edit the Sonic Cameos list please tell me.Ultimatedude127

Sonictoast
Thanks Morph, I have been working hard on them. And thanks for going through a making corrections here and there, grammar and spelling has never been a huge strong point for me, but I try. I'm hoping other users will catch on and start working on the cartoons too, maybe one of these days. 10 episodes down, just 55 more to go. Sonictoast 21:26, April 28, 2010 (UTC)

That's cool, good luck with that. I'd help except I've never read StC. I'm trying to see if I could find the whole collection on ebay or something, then just order them all at once. I do want to start working on the Archie comics, because I have every issue of those, but right now I think I've got some momentum with aosth, so I'm gonna stick with just that for now. Sonictoast 14:42, April 29, 2010 (UTC)

Hi
Hi I am kinda new here but my friend recgamboy is here well,never mind.Just thought I'd say hi.

Drago99 Zenoheld is after you!!! 03:50, May 2, 2010 (UTC)

Hello
My computer is very bad and I had to make two Ronic The Hedgehog sites, so if there is no problem, do not change anything please.

Hello
And one more thing, I just want to know that you see the list just right aside the wikipedia of Ronic, "Pages I follow" Can you put User:Turok The Hedgehog/Ronic The Hedgehog there? I dont know how.

Hi
Hello! I just thought I'd ask you how making articles on Sonic the Comic is going. Just remember, I'm always available to help with those if you would like. Bye! (Oh, do you know how to get rid of the redlink at the beginning of my signature? Thanks!)--Shadow34 00:06, May 7, 2010 (UTC)Shadow34


 * Yes! My signature doesn't have the redlink any more. Thanks!--Shadow34 23:34, May 7, 2010 (UTC)

Hello
I dont need the user page Ronic The Hedgehog user page, I want people to get more know with my article I created on Turok. You know, maby its wierd, but I made the character

Hello
Can You protect my article sometimes? against Vandalism or anything else? I need protection

Hello
Ok thank you!! I have to finish my character article, I tell you for protection when Iam ready!

Free Comic Book Day
I've just created the page for Archie Sonic Free Comic Book Day 2010, which was released last week - however, as I don't have the comic, I can't add anything about the content. I've altered Template:comics to include it as well. Digifiend 04:36, May 8, 2010 (UTC)

I can't say that Sonicrox14 is a beaurecrat!
Hey Super, I heard some rumers about a blue hedgehog, who is dresed up as Batman, traveling arouns Station Square at night pumbling crooks right and left. Is this true? :O Phoenix the Cat  The flames reborn....  06:49, May 15, 2010 (UTC)

Sorry if I creeped you out, I was saying hi by being random. Anyway, what's up? Phoenix the Cat The flames reborn....  06:56, May 15, 2010 (UTC)

I'm just doing some last minute browsing before I leave for the night. Technically, I'm not even supposed to be on right now :P But yeah, I saw that you were on, so I figured that I'd say hello before I left. Anyway, goodnight! Sorry if I interupted anything! Phoenix the Cat The flames reborn....  07:04, May 15, 2010 (UTC)