Forum:New Custom User Right?

Hello, while looking at the Recent Changes and Wiki Activity, I seem to notice that we get a lot of bad file names and we get a lot of spam blog comments, and most of the time, us admins are not there to stop this. While we would have to establish a policy about the file names (which is kind of necessary, especially when we get photos by the name of "IMG" or "Image" or just a spam title of letters), we should still do something about this. I suggest making a custom user right, which is possible FYI, one that could edit blog comments and blogs, move files, and mark comments and pages as patrolled. We can come up with the name later, but I highly suggest this in order to possibly get some more protection and quick deletion and moves around here. This could actually be very useful, so try to think it entirely through before you oppose or support, because this could be entirely good for the wiki, considering the blog comments and file names we get. I hope you can understand what I said. Opinions? -- 22:41, November 9, 2011 (UTC)

I'm up for this. Sounds very helpful. Sandra the Porcupine "No ordinary porcupine!"   22:49, November 9, 2011 (UTC)

I think this is a beyond good idea, there is a lot of vandalism during the day and no admins are on sometimes, I have had an experience, trust me. So this is probably the best idea I've heard yet. Call me Hyper, Call me Hearts  Just don't call me 58, Cuz I'm not that old!  22:51, November 9, 2011 (UTC)

So you're saying that we should vote for a user which can manipulate blogs, delete spam comments and mark them to be patrolled by major title-users?? I gotta say, the idea is good! --- Knowall - November 09, 2011 20:50


 * Pretty much yes, they can do anything witht he files and blogs and the comments that the admins can. -- 22:52, November 9, 2011 (UTC)

Knowall came up with a name, Wiki Overseer. I think it sounds good. So thats what I'll use if everyone agrees, Hyper, and Knowall agreed via chat. And if we don't want the file name thing in, we can call it Blog Overseer? -- 22:53, November 9, 2011

Sounds very helpful. We definetly need this. --ModrenSonic 22:58, November 9, 2011 (UTC)

Sounds like a good idea. A lot of users vandalize when there's no admin around. Mariosonic15 22:57, November 9, 2011 (UTC)

This would be a very convenient position for a wiki user, I am all for the idea. Serious  Sam   Heavy  22:59, November 9, 2011 (UTC)Sacorguy79

Please note that they can't delete the mainspace stuff, this only goes for the files and blogs. -- 22:59, November 9, 2011 (UTC)

I support this 100%. As for the name, why not just call the position Overseer? Jake the Hedgehog  The Ultimate Apprentice  23:01, November 9, 2011 (UTC)

I can't think of a reason why not to. --Rainbowroad6w, the researcher. ( Talk )( Recent finds and updates. ) 23:02, November 9, 2011 (UTC)

Jake, that could lead to false assumptions, a more specific title would be more appropriate. -- 23:04, November 9, 2011 (UTC)

@Franc, Okay. I don't entirely understand why that would be but you usually know what your talking about more than I do. Jake the Hedgehog  The Ultimate Apprentice  23:06, November 9, 2011 (UTC)

What if people see if the overseer is on or offline leading to the reason of this dicussion in the first place? -- Time Biter 23:09, November 9, 2011 (UTC)

That's possible, but the point is to provide more protection for the wiki. Files and Blog Comments are the two places that we get the most spam and unnecessary things (such as bad file names and bad blog comments). This could help the wiki, just because we have admins, approximately 15 hours of the day, an admin doesn't edit, and this would provide an extra layer of protection. -- 23:12, November 9, 2011 (UTC)

I'm in favor of this. --'Wkmeads1  GET OVER HERE!''' 23:16, November 9, 2011 (UTC)

People would request for this right, correct? --Rainbowroad6w, the researcher. ( Talk )( Recent finds and updates. ) 01:50, November 10, 2011 (UTC)

Correct you are. -- 01:55, November 10, 2011 (UTC)

Ok Yoda. ;-) --Rainbowroad6w, the researcher. ( Talk )( Recent finds and updates. ) 01:57, November 10, 2011 (UTC)

I am in-favor.--58SlugDrones • (Contact) 05:51, November 10, 2011 (UTC)

Actually, I never intended for them to have the ability to delete blog comments and files, someone just suggested that. I can remove that power if you like. -- 12:42, November 10, 2011 (UTC)

I oppose now, sorry. Genesjs makes a valid point there. Thus, I think we shouldn't make too many restrictions since inappropriate comments, file names etc. aren't too common.--58SlugDrones • (Contact) 14:03, November 10, 2011 (UTC)

We do understand that we have to request the right, correct? Not everyone gets this power. And I'd be careful supporting whoever is running for it. I'm still supporting this. I don't see why not. It's helpful, quite helpful. Gen just enjoys opposing everything. While I do see what his problem is with it, it's a right that has to be voted for in order for the user to get it. --Rainbowroad6w, the researcher. ( Talk )( Recent finds and updates. ) 14:38, November 10, 2011 (UTC)

Gen makes an excellent point. Perhaps we can simply have a position with only the abilities to edit blogs and blog comments. That would limit the power so it's not too close to an admin. Almost like a "Blog Rollback" if you will. The position would have a small but useful advantage to fight vandals on blogs. What do you guys think? Jake the Hedgehog  The Ultimate Apprentice  15:26, November 10, 2011 (UTC)

@Rainbowroad: I really don't like what you said about Gen. Gen does not enjoy opposing everything. He just doesn't agree and gave a good explanation on why he doesn't. You should know better than to judge someone like that. He is very pleasant and therefore he is honest. Really, I have never met a guy at his age like him.

@Jake: Your solution is better. But I think we don't need this. This situation is not out of hand, especially to such an extent that we are handing this user-right over. --58SlugDrones • (Contact) 15:37, November 10, 2011 (UTC)

@Rainbowroad, like 58 said, Gen doesn't just oppose everything for a reason. HE thinks these things through which is why he opposes them. Many of us simply think of the short term effects of these things.

@58, I agree it's not necessary, but it's always nice to have at least a bit more security on the wiki. Either way, you and i are the only ones to agree with my idea so far so we'll have to wait and see. Jake the Hedgehog  The Ultimate Apprentice  15:47, November 10, 2011 (UTC)

First off Jake, I already came up with that idea earlier when I said we don't have to use the file thing if we don't want, and no one cared to pay attention to what I said and assumed they would ger all the rights. Second, rollback wouldn't be an appropriate name, look up the definition. Third, I oppose, Gen did bring up a good point, and the blog comments don't contain spam or uncensored profanity too often. So now, I oppose. Fourth. 58 didn't support your idea, she said it's better but she doesn't think we need this, that is not a support. -- 18:40, November 10, 2011 (UTC)

@Franc, you made that pretty clear. Anyway, I think I oppose the entire thing now that I think about it. The Wkia Staff is right. This isn't necessary and the vandalism on blogs and files is overrated. I find it useless at this point. Jake the Hedgehog  The Ultimate Apprentice  20:16, November 10, 2011 (UTC)


 * Well, there is still pretty much a community consensus to activate the right. -- 20:40, November 10, 2011 (UTC)

hm... jake/58/genesjs does have a point. i think that we still need this right though... we get a lot of nasty blog comments give me sometime to think it over. i am leaning toward supporting this, --Felectrify (talk) 20:47, November 10, 2011 (UTC)

I'm gonna break out the oppose template here and say this is probably not necessary. What convinced me was daNASCAT's comment at the bottom of the page that "users who aren't trusted enough to be an admin shouldn't be trusted to be a "half-admin". Either you are a trustworthy user to be in a position of power or you are not." Besides, we don't even have consensus about what this new user group would be expected to do. It sounds to me as though we're expecting them to perform very specific jobs. That rarely works out. -- Supermorff 21:49, November 10, 2011 (UTC)

Abilities

 * Editing Blog Comments and Blogs
 * Moving Files
 * Deleting Files and Blogs
 * Marking revisions as patrolled

Reply From Wiki Staff
Traditionally, Wikia Community Support does not allow for much, if any, user rights change. I am willing to, due to the size of the wiki and your history with vandalism, grant this request is approved but I would like to explain why we normally hedge on extra user groups as something to consider in this community's decision. There are two main reasons:


 * 1) Extra bureaucracy and drama - Visitors to the wiki will be confused trying to understand where exactly a user falls in terms of trust and position if extra user groups don't have a blatantly obvious name (did you know what a "bureaucrat" was before you joined a wiki? What would you think if you saw "Imager" or "Blog watcher"?) Furthermore, how will you determine who gets what position? From my past experience, users who aren't trusted enough to be an admin shouldn't be trusted to be a "half-admin". Either you are a trustworthy user to be in a position of power or you are not. This means more votes, more debates, more users upset they can't even get into a "minor position of power"?
 * 2) It's hard to maintain - With each new feature or change we make to user group rights, we have to go back and make sure extra user groups have the right and proper rights. You will probably have to vote on whether this extra group should get a new right for a new feature.

Anyway, these are some of my thoughts on behalf of Wikia. I'm not Trying to scare you off if you all feel this is in the best interest of your community, but I'm just trying to lend a voice of caution. Many wikis think "Yeah, extra user groups would be great!" without really considering much of the downside. This is a mature enough community to figure it out on its own (and some communities, such as Runescape, have done a good job with their extra groups), so good luck! --daNASCAT http://images2.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb32675/wikia/images/e/e9/WikiaStaff.png (help forum | blog) 18:55, November 10, 2011 (UTC)


 * So, you are going to add the extra user group? FYI I opposed the second idea, not my original one. --